Tackling the Issue

At the mall on Wednesday night this week, we spoke to a man who very quickly asserted that he didn't believe in hell. Despite his apparent hearing of words to the contrary, he made a point to mention that his belief was different and he could not believe that there could be a place like this because God is a forgiving God.

We went through the Law and Grace in our discussion. He admitted to being a liar and thief (though he couched this in the past when he was young), stated he never might have disobeyed his parents, but never taken the Lord's name in vain and even corrected those who had. There was a hint of  him thinking that sins of the youth did not equal being a sinner today so we clarified that one sin (like murder or rape) means you are a sinner for all time. And yet, what we didn't say, or talk about, was whether he thought he currently sinned.

In retrospect, we didn't focus on sin and judgment, but instead on grace and God's love and acceptance of us. We had limited time as when his wife showed up she seemed ready to go and take him, but I pressed Bobby to continue talking (Bobby was doing all the talking).

But why didn't we tackle the issue of hell? This man's belief in no hell meant that life could be lived in whatever manner deemed appropriate. He stated that consequences are present in this life for wrong behavior (breaking the law), but God is one of forgiveness.

Reading this morning Francis Chan's book, "Erasing Hell: What God Said abut Eternity, and the Things We've Made Up" he remarks that "Jesus threatens hell to those who curse their brother (Matt 5:22)." And he states earlier that while many of us just want to think that only the devil and his angels go to hell, Revelation is clear that "the cowardly, the faithless, the detestable, the murderers, the sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars" will experience separation from God for all eternity (Revelation 21:8).

I guess I'm thinking that we need to be better listeners and not feel like we shouldn't speak on the subject at hand. It was fine to share the usual message that we share in talking to people of Law and Grace, but the real issue with this man (Joe Romero was his name) was his own thinking that hell was not an option. And we really should have focused our conversation on this for it really is the crux of his belief.

Ten Things

I saw this on a video a friend sent in respect to the future and uncertainty.

1. Learn new skills.
2. Improve your health, both mental and physical.
3. Store back-up food
4, Create a how-to library
5. Start a side business
6. Gather trade-able goods
7. Build community alliances
8. Alternative energy
9. Water purification
10. Love and appreciate

Ephesians 2:4-7 - Gift, Glory, Grace

Erik Christensen gave the message this past Sunday--September 23, 2012. My 2 LDS missionary friends were with me. It was an incredible time of worship to Jesus and then this teaching was just phenomenal. I'm not sure if the younger one was listening much, but Elder Rudy was definitely listening as I saw him flipping to James 2, wondering I think about what it was saying because Erik was very clear that their are no works involved.

But God, being rich in mercy, because of the great love with which he loved us, even when we were dead in our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ—by grace you have been saved—and raised us up with him and seated us with him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, so that in the coming ages he might show the immeasurable riches of his grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus.
(Ephesians 2:4-7 ESV)

We live under the banner, "By Grace You have been saved."

How is grace going to be enacted in our life? In Christ. Our Identity is In Christ. And then our conduct reflects our identity in Christ.

Erik asked, "Are we walking according to the course of this world?" On the contrary, He is in us and He is a part of everything in our lives.

Such is the confidence that we have through Christ toward God. Not that we are sufficient in ourselves to claim anything as coming from us, but our sufficiency is from God, who has made us sufficient to be ministers of a new covenant, not of the letter but of the Spirit. For the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.
(2 Corinthians 3:4-6 ESV)

Of note here is walking of the course of the world, by the law, or living the letter of the law--this kills. It is the Spirit that gives life. When we walk to the course of the world, do we think that our walking and our good deeds is making us sufficient?

1. These are factual statements. Not based on feeling.
2. It is a done deal. It is finished.
3. It is the basis of our hope. Assurance changes our walk.

A.  The Gift
verse 5 - God "made us alive together with Christ"

Like baking a cake, you put ingredients into the cake. After it bakes, you then can't decide to take out certain ingredients from the cake. It is complete. In Christ, we are complete. Nothing can be removed.

If the Spirit of him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, he who raised Christ Jesus from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through his Spirit who dwells in you.
(Romans 8:11 ESV)

And you, who were dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made alive together with him, having forgiven us all our trespasses,

(Colossians 2:13 ESV)

My citizenship is in heaven. I have received the Gift of life, eternal life. As Christ is resurrected, I have been resurrected. I have life.

B. The Glory
verse 6 - "and raised us up with him and seated us with him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus"

When was I raised up? When I believed. At that moment, I was raised up.

having been buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised with him through faith in the powerful working of God, who raised him from the dead.
(Colossians 2:12 ESV)

I am "not of this world" any longer. This is not by feelings. We don't walk by feelings. We walk by faith.

When God sees me right now, he sees me seated with him in the heavenly places. How does this occur? Because I am In Christ.

My present Glory is in heaven.

C. The Grace
verse 7 - "the immeasurable riches of his grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus."

Grace = Favor

Jesus went to the cross with joy.

Kindness is usefulness; it is without sharpness. "There is nothing in Him that would cause us to be repulsed."

Jesus says, "I am here to help you. I will lay down my life for you."

Salvation is a completed action.

Or do you presume on the riches of his kindness and forbearance and patience, not knowing that God's kindness is meant to lead you to repentance?
(Romans 2:4 ESV)

It is God's kindness that leads us to repentance.

But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control; against such things there is no law.
(Galatians 5:22-23 ESV)

Kindness is not in us. It is borne by the Spirit in us. It manifests itself because of the Spirit of God.

God in me produces kindness.


Circumstances don't define us.
     -- Our identity is In Christ
          -- We are made alive with Christ.

Deacon Meeting - September 2012

We had our first deacon's meeting in some time. It was led by the new Chairman of Deacons, Rick Davison. The senior pastor, Erik Christensen, started things off and gave us a good challenge.

Erik's Words

For those who serve well as deacons gain a good standing for themselves and also great confidence in the faith that is in Christ Jesus.
(1 Timothy 3:13 ESV)

We were reminded that the work of a deacon allows the pastoral staff can have time in the Word. Deacons come alongside pastors and elders in a three fold way.

1. PRAY - Prayer with pastor / elders for the ministry and individuals ministries
2. CARE - Care of people and families in that ministry
3. HELP - Helping with specific needs of that ministry

The church is currently wanting to make sure all of the ministries in the church are discipleship based and are leading to discipleship (K-Groups and D-Groups). In the future, will focus on leadership training to more shepherd the Body. 

Goal is to move to people involved in ministry versus that pastoral staff involved in ministry. Pastor's need to shepherd the flock. Ministry is for everyone. 

Rick's Words

Therefore, as you received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk in him, rooted and built up in him and established in the faith, just as you were taught, abounding in thanksgiving.

(Colossians 2:6-7 ESV)

His message that no matter what is going on in your life, no matter how circumstances change, we are to "continue to walk." Don't give up. We will be tempted. We will be tested. Sickness may come our way. Death may hit our families. But, we need to "continue to walk."